September 29, 2026 · GAMING OVERSIGHT · 2,984 words · 31 speakers · 269 segments
Thank you. Thank you. Good? Good? Ready?
Good morning everyone. I'd like to call this meeting of the House Gaming Oversight Committee to order. Bob, if you'd please take the roll. Hey, be quiet.
Chairman Harkins.
Here.
Representative Carroll.
Designation.
Representative Cepeda Freites.
Designation.
Representative Doherty.
Designation.
Representative Friel.
Designation.
Representative Gallagher.
Here.
Representative Dural.
Here.
Representative Guzman.
Designation.
Representative Harris.
Here.
Representative McAndrew.
Designation.
Representative Mirsky.
Here.
Representative Rusnock.
Designation.
Representative Scott.
Designation.
Representative Tabursio.
Here.
Chairman Diamond.
Here.
Representative Benninghoff.
Here.
Representative Fritz.
Here.
Representative Hogan.
Designation.
Representative Kephart.
Designation.
Representative Mahaffey.
Designation.
Representative Mostello.
Here.
Representative Rossi.
Here.
Representative Rencavige.
Here.
Representative Tomlinson.
Designation.
Representative Watrow.
Present.
Representative Williams.
Designation.
Kephart is here.
With the quorum being here, we're ready to begin the meeting. Today we are here to consider two Senate bills that both passed through the Senate chamber unanimously. Chair calls up Senate Bill 398, printers number 345. Jim, if you'll read a summary of the bill.
Senate Bill 398 implements a pilot program for fire companies and authorizes them to conduct two online raffles in the calendar year with the current expiration of December 31st of 2026.
Question is, will the committee report the bill? I will be offering Amendment A04322. Jim, can you give a brief description?
Amendment A04322 adds a subsection which ensures the bill complies with the Federal Unlawful Internet Gambling Enforcement Act by providing that the organization must employ a method to verify the individual who buys a raffle ticket is located within the Commonwealth at the time of sale and changes the expiration date listed in the bill from December 31, 2026 to December 31 of 2027.
Will the committee agree to the amendment? Is there any discussion?
Mr. Chairman.
All right. Representative Benninghoff.
I apologize. Just wanted to ask a couple questions if I may. Is there any kind of maximum limits on what these raffles can raise or not? or minimums or it just seems to be helpful to have a little bit of background information. I appreciate I don't hear as fast as you talk, but it would be helpful to get a little background and see what the amendment's doing to either enhance that or hinder it.
It doesn't change any of the raffle limits. They're still bound by the limits set in the Small Games Act.
Okay.
Is there anyone else? Question, comment? Seeing none, all those in favor, say aye. Bob, if you call the roll.
Chairman Harkins?
Yes.
Chairman Carroll? Representative Carroll?
Designation.
Representative Cepete Frehties?
Designation.
Representative Daugherty?
Yes.
Representative Friol?
Designation, yes.
Representative Gallagher?
Yes.
Representative Jarrall?
Yes.
Representative Guzman?
Designation, yes.
Representative Harris?
Yes Representative McAndrew Designation yes Representative Mirsky Yes Representative Rusnak Representative Scott
Designation yes. Representative Tiberseo. Chairman Dimon. Representative Benninghoff. Representative Fritz. Representative Hogan. Representative Kephart.
Representative Mahaffey.
The amendment is agreed to.
Wattro offers amendment A04338.
Jim, please provide a summary of the amendment.
A04338 will add veterans organizations to the groups permitted to conduct online raffles under this bill.
I would move to table the amendment A04338. Is there any discussion on the motion?
Representative Wattro.
Thanks, Mr. Chairman. This amendment is to just simply include veterans organizations into this bill. Our veterans organization, AMVETS, VFWs, American Legion, they struggle financially. And putting just this piece in there for them is going to help them tremendously. Keep the doors open. Help our veterans. Me being a veteran personally, every little bit matters. and I'd appreciate no vote to table. Thank you.
Any other discussion? While I appreciate the amendment, this is part of something that we are working on as a bigger, broader picture with the small games of chance and other things like that. I would ask for a no vote. A yes vote, I'm sorry. I'm sorry, a yes vote, please. Jim, if you call the roll.
Chairman Harkins?
Yes.
Representative Carroll?
Yes.
Designation, yes. Representative Cepeda Freites?
Designation, yes.
Representative Doherty? Representative Friel?
Designation, yes.
Representative Gallagher?
Yes.
Representative Gerrall?
Yes.
Representative Guzman? Designation, yes. Representative Harris?
Is that a yes?
Yes.
Representative Harris?
I knew it was a yes.
Representative McAndrew?
Designation, yes.
Representative Mirsky?
Yes.
Representative Rusnock?
Yes.
Representative Scott?
Designation, yes.
Representative Tabersio? Chairman Diamond?
No.
Representative Benninghoff?
No to table.
Representative Fritz?
No.
Representative Hogan?
Designation, no.
Representative Kephart?
No.
Representative Mahaffey?
Designation, no.
Representative Mostello?
No.
Representative Rossi?
No.
Representative Rencavige?
No.
Representative Tomlinson?
Designation no.
Representative Watrow?
No.
Representative Williams?
Designation no.
14 yays, 12 nays.
The motion having passed, the amendment is tabled. We will now proceed to the next amendment.
Representative Watrow also offers amendment A04339.
Will the committee agree to the amendment? On that question, the chair recognizes Representative Wattro.
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Not only will this help our local hometown fire departments, but it's also going to help our small businesses. Many of these fire companies, they purchase supplies to do their online raffling from our local butcher shops, Yeti coolers, Penn State swag, Knoebels tickets, purses. And I was just told this morning these Michael Kors purses really go pretty quickly. Lawn and supply equipment for power equipment. And I could go on and on. But these fire departments, they join to keep us safe, to fight fires. They're not professional fundraisers. And I think that giving them the capability and limiting them to only two a year is tough. A couple fire companies back home do about 35 raffles a week. I misspoke yesterday in speaking to some members that thinking that they only do five a week where it's actually 35, whether if it's gift cards, so on and so forth. these departments, you know, they help themselves. They're doing food drives, potato cakes, but they're not raising the money like they should to keep the doors open. It's not going to hurt anybody by giving them extended opportunities to help fund their departments to keep us safe. I just ask for an affirmative vote on this amendment to have unlimited raffles so they could continue on doing great things for our community. I appreciate it, Mr. Chairman. Thank you.
Thank you, Representative Watrow. Jim, if you would give a brief overview of.
Just for clarification, this amendment, the original bill has a limit of no more than two online raffles per year. this amendment would remove that limit so there could be any number of online raffles.
I would ask for a yes vote on this. Bob, if you take the roll.
Mr. Chair, real quick.
I'm sorry. I'm sorry.
Representative Benninghoff.
I just want to add for historic perspectives and for the younger members, you know, in the last 30 years, we've gone from 300,000 firefighters to 30. we're still a state that's predominantly volunteer firefighters what are they asking for an opportunity to go earn money to serve us they're not asking for free money they're not asking for tax dollars they're asking for an opportunity to spend their friday nights their weekends out soliciting donations so they can try to do these online sales at the end of the day when you dial 911 you don care who shows up as long as somebody shows up Well guess what People are going to stop showing up And the last part of that is the average firefighter is about 50 to 55 years old This is not easy putting that gear on To outfit one guy is $2,000, and that's without the air packs. This equipment, the fire retardant equipment, lasts 10 years maximum, and you have to get rid of it. All we're asking is for the opportunity for these people to spend their time away from their families to raise money so they can be away from their families to protect our home and property. This is ridiculous.
Thank you. Thank you, Representative Benninghoff. Is there any other discussion? Yes, Representative. Thank you, Chair.
And I agree with everyone's comments. They are mostly volunteer. This is a way for them to raise money. As I understand this, and if I can just get clarification on this, what we're voting on is a bill that would approve a pilot program, correct? A pilot program that right now is just saying two online raffles, and the fire departments can run as many other raffles as they like throughout the year. so I don't feel like we're saying that they can never do this I feel like we are running this to see how it will work and you know gain insight into it so that in the future they will be able to run more online raffles I just want to clarify that they can run as many in-person raffles as they like. So could I get clarification on that chair, please?
Subject to the prize limits already in the Small Games of Chance Act, but yes. Thank you, Representative. Any other questions or comments? Seeing none, Bob, if you take the roll.
Chairman Harkins? Yes, here. Representative Carroll? Designation, yes. Representative Cepeda-Fratis? Designation, yes. Representative Dougherty?
Yes.
Representative Friel?
Designation, yes.
Representative Gallagher?
Yes.
Representative Gerrall?
Yes.
Representative Guzman?
Designation, yes.
Representative Harris?
Yes.
Representative McAndrew?
Designation, yes.
Representative Mursky?
Yes.
Representative Rusnock?
Yes.
Representative Scott?
Designation, yes.
Representative Taborcio? Chairman Diamond?
Yes.
Representative Benninghoff?
Yes.
Representative Fritz?
Yes.
Representative Hogan?
Designation, yes.
Representative Kephart?
Yes.
Representative Mahaffey?
Designation, yes.
Representative Mostello?
Designation, yes.
Representative Rossi?
Yes.
Representative Rincävige?
Yes.
Representative Tomlinson?
Designation, yes.
Representative Wattrow?
Yes.
Representative Williams?
Designation, yes.
26 yays.
The amendment is agreed to.
Representative Wattro offers amendment A04340.
Jim, please provide summary of the amendment.
This amendment, A04340, removes the sunset date altogether from the bill.
And I would move to table the amendment A04340. Is there any discussion on this motion?
Mr. Chairman?
Yes, Representative Wachow.
I understand there's another amendment to make this sunset December of 2027?
That was in the bill, I believe, yes. That was in Representative Harkin's amendment. Yes.
I would draw this amendment. Thank you.
Thank you, Representative. The question recurs. Will the committee report this bill as amended? Any discussion? Seeing none, those in favor of the bill as amended will vote A. Those opposed no will vote no. Are there any negative votes? I'm sorry. Seeing none, the bill passes. Thank you. Unanimous. And the bill will be reported as passing. Chair calls up Senate Bill 416, printers number 403. Jim, will you read a summary of that bill?
Senate Bill 416 will amend the Small Games of Chance Act to allow raffle tickets to be purchased with a debit or credit card, mobile payment, or other electronic payment method.
Will the committee report the bill? Is there any discussion? I will be offering amendments A04308. Jim, could you give a brief description of that amendment?
The representative of Amendment A04308 adds a provision to ensure that the bill complies with the Federal Unlawful Internet Gambling Enforcement Act by providing that the organization must employ a method to verify the individual who buys a raffle ticket is located within the Commonwealth at the time of sale.
Will the committee agree to the amendment? Any discussion? Seeing none. All those in favor of the amendment will vote A. All those opposed will vote no. Bob, if you take the roll.
Chairman Harkins?
Yes, here.
Representative Carroll?
Designation, yes.
Representative Cepeda Freites?
Designation, yes.
Representative Doherty? Representative Friel?
Designation, yes.
Representative Gallagher?
Yes.
Representative Gerald?
Yes.
Representative Guzman?
Designation, yes.
Representative Harris?
Yes.
Representative McAndrew?
Designation, yes.
Representative Mursky?
Yes.
Representative Rusnak?
Yes.
Representative Scott?
Designation, yes.
Representative Taburcio? Chairman Hart — Chairman Diamond?
Yes.
Representative Bendinghoff?
Yes.
Representative Fritz?
Representative Hogan.
Designation, yes. Representative Kephart. Representative Mahaffey.
Designation, yes.
Representative Mostello.
Yes.
Representative Rossi.
Yes.
Representative Rencavige.
Yes.
Representative Tomlinson.
Designation, yes.
Representative Watrow.
Yes.
Representative Williams.
Designation, yes.
Unanimous. The amendment passes unanimously. Thank you. Will the committee report the bill as amended? Any debate? Any discussion?
Chairman Diamond. Chairman Harkins I want to thank you for bringing this bill up We been kind of fighting for this bill ever since COVID I believe it was Representative Warner who first came up with this bill on our side of the aisle in the House. And we've been, and I'm so thankful for your amendment that makes it comport with federal law, because that's kind of been the hitch all along. You know, taking these kind of modern payments. I mean, I use my phone to pay for gas. I use to pay it for supplements. I order online. I use it for everything. And bringing this into the 21st century is just absolutely the right thing to do. I mean, the day of bake sales and even dangerous boot drives, where they're standing along the highway and chicken barbecues, although I do want to give a shout-out to Bunker Hill Fire Company in Jonestown, which makes the best barbecue chicken ever. But those days are over. The equipment these folks have to buy doesn't cost $10,000. It's not $50,000. It's a million dollars. It's $2 million for some of these pieces of equipment. So for them to raise money using modern technology, just like we all do, for the rest of our entire lives, you know, nobody – few people carry cash around, and I know no one who's carrying their checkbook around anymore. In fact, people laugh at me when I pull out a check. So I wholeheartedly support this bill, and I hope that everyone – I believe everyone on the Republican side is going to be a yes, but maybe you just want to ask for a show of hands if there's a no, okay?
Sure. Your points are very well taken and appreciated. I would just add that I agree 100 percent with what you're saying. I would just hope that going forward we could look at helping some of these fire departments from the state level with our budgeting process. these people do offer everything that they've got for us. And many of these rural areas, there's not a lot of connection between a lot of things. They need help financially. I understand that, and I realize it. And at budget time, we don't look at helping these people out. And so I would hope that I could add that caveat, that we all agree that we need to work together to help these people, not just with these kind of things, but with purchases and equipment that they need to keep them healthy, happy, and safe. Is there any other discussion? Are there any no votes? Seeing none, the bill passes unanimously. Thank you. The bill will be reported as passing unanimously, as amended. Thank you. Next, I would like to offer the microphone to Chairman Diamond for a few comments.
Thank you, Chairman Harkins. I am so glad that we're meeting today on some substantive issues in gaming to help these volunteer fire companies come to the modern day life that the rest of us are used to. I just wanted to mention that I am so frustrated and dismayed that we are not talking about the elephant in the room, which is skill games. I'm not going to insult anybody here. We are under a Supreme Court deadline, and we should be getting something done. And I just wanted to mention that here with all the committee members here that I absolutely think we should be. We have a number of bills before this committee that deal with skill games. And I hope that in the coming days, we schedule another meeting to talk about that topic before tens of thousands or hundreds of thousands of people who have made those games an integral part of their livelihood, whether they were legal or not, are left out in the cold. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Thank you, Chairman Diamond. I appreciate those comments. we are trying our best to try and formulate something that might work. I don't close the door on anybody, but I turn it back to the Senate Republican leadership who has told us for four years that they have no intention and they have no ability to get the votes for anything at this point in time. It's difficult to negotiate by ourselves. Like I said, my door is always open. I get a number of calls, texts, all times of the day and night, have for probably six months regarding this issue. We're going to try and do something. I never want to close the door on anything. But with that said, that's about all we can do at this point. Any other discussion? Yes.
Yes, good morning. Yeah, you know, I would like to also comment on skilled games. You know, we've got the market saturated out there, supporting a lot of businesses, fire departments. And I will hope that it doesn't die in a vine also, you know, because just like, you know, the lottery, the raffles, you know, helping fire departments raise money for their equipment. A lot of small businesses need support, not just for this body. This body, I think, supports it. But the Senate, to hold that bill up, is atrocious, I think, that when you look at all these businesses across the state, and we're wrangling over how much they should pay, and we also know, the Senate should know also exclusively, that we can't compare skilled gains with slot machines at the casino. And as everyone knows, slot machines at the casino are the only... game in the casinos that's taxed at that rate. Every other gaming and the casinos are taxed at a lower rate. So hopefully we can come to some conclusion with that. Thank you.
Thank you, Representative. With that being said, the meeting is now adjourned. Thank you. Thank you.