May 12, 2026 · Finance · 3,735 words · 11 speakers · 61 segments
Thank you. Thank you. The committee will come to order. Please call the roll.
Representatives Brooks.
Macho. Here.
DeGraff. Garcia.
Gonzalez. Art Sook. Marshall. Stewart.
Zokai. Tatum. Mr. Chair. Here. Welcome to the last meeting of House Finance. We have one bill, Senate Bill 183. We have our sponsors here. Who would like to kick us off? Representative Lindsay.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. Thank you, committee. This is my last bill to present in committee for this session, so very excited to be here with you all. Rep Winter and I, sorry, excuse me, Assistant Minority Leader Winter and I are here to present Senate Bill 183. For anybody who doesn't know, we serve on capital development together, and we get to look at all of the state properties and look at their capital requests. This bill comes out of that area of work. And so here's a little bit of background. In 2024, the General Assembly enacted HB 1231, authorizing Certificates of Participation, also known as COPs, COPs, a form of bond financing for certain higher education capital projects relating to health sciences. This bill set a maximum annual state appropriation limit of $17.5 million to pay debt service on the COPs. SB 26183 adds the Colorado School of Mines to the list of institutions that can use this COP option. It is using the leftover funds from the existing appropriation and does not impact the COPs that the other institutions have already initiated. The 2024 legislation estimated that the debt service for the COPs was going to be $17.5 million, which was appropriated through 1231. Once the COPs were finalized, the actual debt service was $16.7 million, leaving $780,000. That is the amount that the Colorado School of Mines is targeting for a COP for Guggenheim Hall. And I will turn it over to AML Winter to tell you about Guggenheim.
AML Winter. Thank you, Mr. Chair. The $780,000 has already been appropriated and has accounted for in the budget. At today's interest rates, this payment capacity could fund approximately $12 to $13 million of COP principal. No new appropriations is needed. The Colorado School of Mines has an urgent capital renewal need for Guggenheim Hall, including replacement and modernization of critical building systems necessary to preserve the facility's functionality, safety, and long-term use. The project is estimated to cost approximately $15.7 million. Colorado School of Mines will cover all costs above the COP principal amount of $13 million. The bill clarifies that additional annual payments of Guggenheim Hall's COPs when combined with payments on the 2024 COPs may not exceed the current $17.5 million annual cap. A representative from the Colorado School of Mines is here to provide more details about why the funding is needed and it's time sensitive if you all would like to know more. And we urge you to vote.
Committee, any questions for the bill sponsors? Yes, Representative Stewart.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. Help me understand the out-year almost $800,000 general fund appropriation and how we're going to pay for that. Representative Lindsay.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. Thank you for the question, Rep. Stewart. And we have some backup here to if we are not getting all the details exactly correct. But this COP payment amount was established and approved. And so with the current projects that are already allocated under that, there is some leftover. We're not using the entire amount that was approved. And so we are using that leftover to pay for this project, which is the total of the $13 million. But then the annual payments is that $800,000. But it's already appropriated. It's already approved, and we're just putting a project to the allocation.
Representative Kamasho. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Representative Lindsay and Amal Winter. So I'm looking at the fiscal note. It only has the out year of 2728, but if you look at the explanation in the fiscal note, it says this is a 780,000 annual potential COP participation from the Treasury. that's not captured in this fiscal note, but is this going to be annual?
Representative Lindsay. Yes, it is my understanding that this will be annual. It's part of the overall payments that we make towards our COP payments for all of these projects. And so that's just, it's already approved. We already have that in our budget to spend this amount towards our COP project payments. And so this is just a project that is added into this fund that's already there. But we have some, like one of our staffers, one of our very smart staffers from CDC is here, knows COP inside and out. And I would encourage you to double check with them or confirm with them.
Oh, you may dialogue.
I just want, so what I heard was this is essentially just a programmatic thing that happens annually. This bill doesn change anything nothing is secure kind of thing But it then why are we here Your dialogue Oh thank you Because we have to get permission to put the Colorado School of Mines under this program
They are not currently, and so that's what the bill needs to do. And I'll turn it over to our lovely CDC staffer to fill you in on more detail.
Lovely CDC staffer. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Brendan Fung, Legislative Council staff. Sorry, prepared the fiscal note. I also do staff CDC. I can answer any further questions that you might have. Representative Lindsay did explain it properly.
Representative Stewart. Thank you, Mr. Chair. It is my understanding that, yes, we are under the cap, but that the annual COP repayments are not actually already appropriated, and this would have to be an additional appropriation.
Yes, sir. Thank you, Representative. Yes, so these are subject to annual appropriations, but they have been accounted for because they are long-term obligations from the state. In this case, the original COP was issued for about $17.5 million. The $780,000 that we have indicated is the difference between what the actual amount is from those four previously approved projects and what is left. Okay.
Representative Stewart. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Well, that makes sense, but it is my understanding that this, yes, theoretically we've been approved for this $17 million COP. We're under the cap and the additional COP repayments are not actually being accounted for in the assumptions, some of the out-year financial assumptions of the state?
Thank you for the question. I would defer that question probably to the JBC in understanding how far out that projection goes, but it has been accounted for in the current long bill.
Any other questions from the committee? Representative DeGraff.
I'm always curious on the COP. How is financing over long term different than debt?
Is that for the analysts?
That was my question for the COP expert, I guess. Sorry.
Thanks for the question. That's not an answer that I can provide sufficiently for you. It operates much like a loan or a bond in the sense that the state is receiving money and then has an obligation to pay it back over time. Generally speaking, COPs are favorable in terms of interest rates as compared to other forms of lending.
All up, Representative DeGraff.
Okay.
Any other questions from the committee? Seeing none, we'll go to the witness testimony phase. Are there any witnesses signed up?
We just got a witness.
Erin, did you want to testify? Come on up. Anyone who wants to testify on Senate Bill 183, please come on down. All right, we'll start with our witness in the room. Please state your name, who you're testifying on behalf of. The floor is yours for three minutes. Thank you, Mr. Chair. And I want to check, Kirsten Volpe with Colorado School of Mines was trying to sign in. We didn't know about the timing. If I can, have her testify first, and then I'll answer any questions. Sure. Ms. Volpe, if you could unmute yourself, state who you're testifying on behalf of. And the floor is yours for three.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. Kirsten Volpe, Chief Financial Officer, Colorado School of Mines. Sorry for joining late, but I appreciate it. So as has been indicated, we are looking to utilize the additional capacity that are currently in the COP bonds that were the COPs that were issued in 2024. Mines did not partake in those COPs at all. And so that differential is about 13 million that we are hoping to utilize for a critical infrastructure project that we have on campus, an old building that needs significant plumbing and HVAC that's in pretty terrible condition. And so we are we're looking to that that that 13 million capacity will have will utilize about seven hundred and eighty thousand, as you have spoken earlier in the conversation regarding what that already in the budget would be for the state of Colorado. There was an earlier question about what is the difference between financing long term and debt with certificates of participation. What the state does is they collateralize assets. So one of our assets here on campus will be utilized to collateralize that certificate of participation, which in a sort of way is like a debt. But in a normal debt payment, there is no collateralization. There still is annual payments, long-term financing, but the terminology is different because it's just a different tool. And so I'm happy to answer any questions or provide any further clarity to the committee on our project. Thank you.
Floors are three. Thank you, Mr. Chair. And I think to answer Representative Stewart's question about the ongoing appropriation, I think it's only through 2728, and it has been accounted for through the current budget process. We worked with the JBC to make sure that we weren't adding to the fiscal responsibility of the state or adding to the budget. and that's why the fiscal note is confusing because it does talk about no appropriations are needed but it shows that outlying 780 next year it's accounted for in the budget moving forward and so it's not any new money that we have to come up with and the important part to note on this is this project's been on the CDC list for multiple cycles if we get this funding we'll be able to take it off the CDC list We're using that $780,000 to pull down $13 million of money that we wouldn't get otherwise, and we would have to stay on that CDC list. Okay, any questions for the witnesses? Representative Stewart Thank you Mr Chair Okay
I know that the COP has, the limit of the COP has already been approved, but it actually hasn't all been spent. And so what is accounted for in the budget right now is the payment on the amount of the COP that we've already used. And what this bill is asking us to do is increase our payback amount, $780,000 a year, year over year, in order, you know, by actually using the credit limit, let's call it, of the COP. So we are being asked to make a decision for the JBC and the General Assembly in the out years. that's almost an extra million dollars in the budget that we don't know about. Is that correct?
Ms. Forthman. Thank you, Mr. Chair. No. What was appropriated in 2024 was the $17.5 million, and that is through 27-28. I don't know the numbers on how much each year, but it is appropriated through that time frame. So when they issued the COPs under that 17.5 limit, it came back after they issued those COPs 16.8. And so that left $780,000 that was appropriated that we can now use to pull down $13 million in financing. So it is already in the budget. It was already appropriated and accounted for. it's just in the out years that it's laid out um trying to figure out if there's an easier way to explain it um that's that's it um it was appropriated at 17.5 came in at 16.8 and so that 780 is still been appropriated the only reason we have to run this bill is because that original bill in 2024 was very specific to the institutions that had health care related facilities and so the statute is very specific to that in order for us to be able to do access that last bit of remaining cop allowance we had to add school of mines for guggenheim hall to the statute
okay thank you mr chair but what if we don't want to access the rest of those cop funds so that we aren't obligating the state to 25 years of additional repayment?
It just sits there, and it doesn't get – sorry, Mr. Chair. It just sits there. It's not something that can roll into the general fund. It's just there for the COPs, and then after the 27-28, it would be gone, but now we can use it to pull down that financing for that building. whereas before it would just sit there and not be used for a couple years. So we're putting, we're maximizing the ability to use that money to our best extent possible in the time frame that we have. Rep Stewart. Any other questions? Representative Marshall. Did you have any? Oh, I did, but I hadn't got my hand up. I was thinking through it. But thank you, Mr. Chair. So... You do have a process. Yeah. Yeah. And start sitting there. I am kind of intrigued that, you know, the School of Mines has the highest median salaries of any graduates in the state, and the original Guggenheim Hall is named after Guggenheim because he donated the money to refurbish the building. So I'm kind of wondering why or what efforts the School of Mines has made to fundraise to undertake this project when, again, you have the highest median salaries of any university or college in the state for your graduates. Ms. Forthman. Thank you, Mr. Chair. So I would say that the School of Mines is a public institution just like the other institutions, CSU, CU, Mesa, all of those. And as part of being in the higher ed system, we get to have the benefit of being in the state and having that access to the funding mechanisms. School of Mines has agreed that any overages over the $13 million for this project, they're going to cover out of their reserves. So they have come to the table. We have put this project as well as other projects on the CDC list for many years and have not received any CDC money for close to 10 years for any project. We have covered a lot of our projects through our fundraising and our own budgets. This is our way of trying to maximize state dollars in the best way possible, using that $780,000 to pull down $13 million of that $15 million project. Ms. Volk, would you like to answer that as well?
Thank you, Mr. Chair. I think Garen did a wonderful job, and it is a good question. And as Garen noted, we have had significant growth on campus and have been able to do a fair amount of fundraising. We've got very, very committed alumni. But for the level of infrastructure work that this campus needs and that matching donors interests aren't necessarily aligned. We've got significant tunneling, pipe, plumbing, HVAC issues that we have been reserving for, but certainly not to the level of what our needs are for this particular building, which was built in 1906 and has considerable deferred maintenance. So so as Garen noted, we've we've been quite successful with fundraising and using other types of creative financing solutions. But this project that we've had on the list really is something that's important for us. And as as Miss Worthman noted, we haven't been funded for anything on the CDC list since about 2018. so we're just we were excited when we heard of this opportunity that there were there was capacity left in the already issued or appropriated COPs and Mr. Chair I have some fact sheets about both the bill and Guggenheim Hall if that project if people are interested I can pass them out
yeah that'd be great we can get those in just a second representative Camacho thank you Mr. Chair
And maybe this is just more of kind of a, like this seems like a fairly straightforward bill but confusing enough Why is this coming the second day of session Like the second to last day of session I mean I feel like this committee could have benefited from a little bit more discussion on this and it just seems I mean I heard about this like two hours ago.
Thank you Mr. Chair. Yeah unfortunately we weren't able to get the bill introduced until after the budget process had gone through we talked with representatives of both the JBC and CDC, about sponsoring the bill, and they wanted to get through the budget process before they picked it up and went with it. So the timing of it is at the end of the session. It went through Senate committee last week and the Senate floor process. We went through both Senate finance unanimously and Senate appropriations with only one no vote, and then there were two no votes on Senate third reading just yesterday. So, unfortunately, we didn't have a lot of time leading up to be able to visit with you guys ahead of time. Representative Camacho.
I appreciate that. I'll just push back a little bit. I think the budget cleared both houses back in March. So I just, I'm still at a lot. I understand, like I get it, but it just makes me a little concerned.
Mr. Chair, I share your frustration. It took us a while to get scheduled in Senate Finance. Okay. Not as efficient as house finance. You guys are very quick. I will give you that. Any further questions for the witnesses? I'd say none. Thank you for your time this afternoon. Final call for witnesses on Senate Bill 183. Seeing none, the witness testimony phase is closed. Bill sponsors, come back up for amendments. We have a strike below. Lorena. Any amendments from the bill sponsors? No amendments. No amendments from the bill sponsors. Committee, any amendments? No amendments from the committee. Amendment phase is closed. Wrap up.
Representative Lindsay. Thank you, Mr. Chair, and thank you, committee. The CDC is a very particular committee with a very specific remit, and we talk about these things a lot. So any apologies for any confusion coming to kind of a new area discussing things. COPs are a big part of how we finance some of the projects. Every year we get a list of, I don't know, maybe up to 50 projects. We are woefully underfunded in how we are maintaining our properties around the state. our job is to look at all these 5 million requests and make a prioritization list that we give to the JBC. And so anything that can figure out how to be funded off that list is a win for the state of Colorado because by the time they even make it to the list, they're already in a certain state by the time they're coming to us. And so we tour around, we see these facilities, we see the needs of our universities, our correctional facilities, state hospitals, and things of that nature. We did have to wait for the budget for this, and then after that we did speak with JBC. And as this came out of Senate appropriations, the JBC members, Representative Bridges, Representative Mobley, and Representative Kirkmaier all voted it out of appropriations. oh yes a senator all of them sorry senator immobile senator bridges and senator kirkmaier thank you rep gonzalez um so through that senate process the jbc members uh voted it through appropriations because we have had those discussions with them beforehand after the budget after we knew what was what this is this leftover piece um we are trying to utilize a financing system to try to take care of anything off of this woefully underfunded Capital Development Committee list. And so I'm very happy to be on this bill to make some progress on our million-mile-long capital project improvements, and I urge an aye vote. Thank you.
Hey, Mel Winter. I urge an aye vote.
Committee, any closing comments? Representative Marshall. Thank you, Mr. Chair. So I came in thinking I'd be an automatic no, but the more I'm thinking through it, you know, this capital development committee, we have buildings at Fort Logan have been shut down with acute critical need for mental health beds. And they say, well, there's no money. All of a sudden we're finding all this money to refurbish a building for a school that is a public school. We give it public support, but has the highest median income of any university or college in the state, private or public. And yet I think our priorities are just not in the right place on this by authorizing this. Meanwhile, while we're ignoring other more critical needs, it should be a higher priority. So I'm going to be a no. Any other closing comments from the committee? All right, seeing none, a proper motion routes Senate Bill 183 to the Committee on Appropriations. Madam Vice Chair. I move Senate Bill 183 to the Committee on Appropriations with a favorable recommendation. Second.
Second by Representative Brooks.
Please poll the committee. Representatives Brooks.
No.
Macho. Pass.
DeGraff No
Garcia No Gonzalez Yes
Art Sook Yes Marshall No
Stewart No
Zokai No
Tatone Yes
Mr. Chair Yes
Camacho No
That fails 7 to 4 Man of Vice Chair Motion I move to postpone indefinitely House Bill 183 on reverse roll call. Senate Bill. Senate Bill, sorry. Senate Bill 183. Is there a second?
Second by Representative Brooks.
Is there any objection to the motion? Seeing none, Senate Bill 183 is postponed indefinitely. Thank you. That concludes our business in House finance, given that we probably aren't getting any more bills, we stand adjourned. Thank you. Thank you.